The Democratic Party’s former leaders are all co-opted just like former Republican leaderless. We have no one to rally progressive Democrats in the fight to save democracy, to restore the rule of law and fight the billionaire oligarchy. If we the people are to resist the well coordinated efforts of U.S. billionaires to resurrect the robber Barron era of the 1900’s, we need national leaders. We also need to embrace civil disobedience and not behave timidly. Civility is not a requisite for sustaining this constitutional democracy. It may be a hindrance. Ending the Vietnam War, Civil rights and Union rights were not achieved in this nation through civility but through bold often disobedient acts. While Martin Luther King advocated peaceful protests, the Black Panthers were a welcome counter approach that brought fear into the consciousness. I am looking for leaders, probably not politicians, who will organize and mobilize an active and feared resistance movement.
Also, by the way, I think the idea that people shouldn't talk to Trump is silly. Trump is massively disregulated. More social contact can help with that. It's absolutely a public service to help with that if you have access. This idea that we should just be awful to people we disagree with is just making the world a worse place. Imagine if Trump were perfectly happy. Like, really, truly happy, not just happy with his latest endorphin hit. Would he be talking about invading Greenland?
Sadly, I have known people in the past who are, at best, 'consistently inconsistent' - or in old money, two-faced. The challenge is to find a clear path through ...
I think it's silly to talk about this for at least a year. The current Democratic national leadership are .. I don't even know what to say about them. I think they are more the problem than Trump is, and that's really damning them with faint praise. Until they get out of the way, all we can do is work locally. And since they keep spending tons of money to screw up local races, even that is an uphill battle.
I don't really want to hear what they have to say. The time for that is past. If Kamala Harris had issued a mea culpa, if Blinken had admitted he was wrong about Gaza, etc, then maybe I'd be willing to hear something from them. As it is, I still care about them as human beings. E.g., I hope Kamala Harris is okay, and her husband is okay. But as politicians, what I want most from them is that they GTFO.
I'm all about Tim Walz, though. I just wish he hadn't let them muzzle him during the campaign.
BTW, to be super clear about this, I don't watch TV news or read the NYT, so even if they were talking, I might now have heard what they said. I read De Volkskrant. They are kind of a footnote from that perspective.
The question is what is wrong with Trump that he feels no embarrassment or shame about how he talked about ALL of these people. He is the one who should be sheepish and embarrassed. His lack of moral or shame is his superpower.
The Democratic leaders who told us that democracy was dead and Trump was Hitler are now saying.. Nah... Didn't really mean that. And, by the way, we will be holding our "resistances" from Martha's Vineyard and Caribbean islands.
This is an important discussion that I completely relate to. I was very conflicted about Obama's chumminess with Trump. On the one hand, I can see him trying to foster a rapport for potential future negotiations to reign in his worst impulses if necessary. On the other hand, W-T-F? I seriously doubt Michelle would have been that gracious (and notice she didn't bother to go.) I don't agree that they were "all" doing that. From what I saw, the Clintons, Bushes, Kamala and Doug, and the Bidens all ignored Trump and Melania. Trump tried to get Kamala's attention and she deliberately did not look at him. Is that enough? No, but this was a state funeral after all. Should they "boycott?" Maybe the family should not have invited him. He wasn't at Barbara Bush's funeral, and if you saw the official photo the Carter Center released, they literally cropped him out of the photo of the assembled dignitaries. Pence shook his hand which is sickening, given that his life was in danger but I don't really expect anything of him. The only person who was "satisfying" was Karen Pence of all people, rebuffing their outreach with contemptuous silence. One black woman in a private group I am in said "Black people have to do this all the time!" so I can respect I have no experience of being in that position in this racist society but I'm also not a former POTUS looked to for leadership. I also appreciate Anand articulating what is underneath the debate. WHERE ARE THE VOCAL, PASSIONATE LEADERS FOR THIS MOMENT? Who is guiding us as we careen toward autocracy? The threats and actions are happening in plain sight and those who warned us don't seem to be doing anything consequential. We're supposed to rely on Chuck Schumer?! Andrew Weissman said it would be "unseemly" for Garland to release the report without permission. We're still talking about politeness in the face of this madness, as climate change rages, burning homes to the ground in CA (including my BF's house?)? I'm glad Anand is here speaking into this because it is vital at this juncture and if someone with the right skills and calling stepped forward, I believe a movement will rapidly coalesce. That's part of the reason why people rallied instantly behind Kamala. Just give us SOMEONE with a backbone to push back against this insanity! /end rant/
Jimmy Carter, bless his soul, always spoke kindly and shared pleasantries with friends and foes alike. That is how he made the most amazing international peace arrangement that was considered impossible, but it still stands, years later.
I am a Canadian living in Canada, I am very deeply angered and insulted by Rrump’s increasing rhetoric about taking over Canada, Greenland, and the Osnsma Canal. If he stops the two wars that are using American munitions, where will he send the USA weaponry, to the Canadian border perhaps? We in Canada hope most people in the USA will support the integrity and sovereignty of Canada, and continue to be allies and friends. The war and power mongers need to be prevented from destroying a centuries long peaceful friendship.
This reminded me of an interview Biden gave a little while before dropping out of the race- when asked about the prospect of trump winning and what that would mean, he essentially answered "well at least I'll have tried my best."
I couldn't stop thinking about that when he pardoned Hunter. I understand the paternal pull to protect his son, but I couldn't stop thinking about that interview. He's done his best, and now he was confident that his family was going to be fine, relatively speaking. He could shield his son, but what have he and his team been doing to protect people not named Biden from the worst impulses of "America's Hitler" (not my phrase, I forget who said it first though 🤔)? They're preparing for a smooth and efficient transition.
And then Obama sits there, chatting it up with trump and I can't get that interview out of my head. Like I'm watching the end of a little league game, and all the presidents are hi fiving, telling each other good game while the referees bulldoze the ballfield and california burns.
It's not a proxy fight, it's class warfare and none of them are on our side.
I think Obama responding to Trump's overtures with bonhomie has to do with his personality traits. He doesn't have anything to defend, and can just be, in his embodied experience. I imagine he'd josh around with anyone who tugged at him like Trump did at that moment, because Obama at ease is gracious, open and up with people.
Would he josh around with Putin that way? Given what they've all said about him - and what he himself says about his agenda - how different is he than that? He is proposing military attacks on allies for god's sake!
I saw you on "Joe" .... do value your honest and objective opinions. I am a Democrat. I am happy that they are adopting a wait and see approach to the Trump Term. He blusters, he accuses, he threatens - will he do it, can he do it - let them take him on when the time is right. They can meet the moment. Trump is making a fool of himself now with his ridiculous battles. I, too, am waiting and seeing. Those leaders I care about are visible and present.
The only problem with that theory is that they will still have agency to "take him on" if they wait. He has both Houses of Congress. SCOTUS backs him for the most part. He will have DOJ/FBI. Will the military resist his directions if he commands them to attack allies or citizens? Waiting to see has degraded institutions beyond recognition already.
MSNBC is just like the other media outlets, money interests first honesty and truth Even when I liked the content I had a basic distrust of them. Most were Republicans to begin with and have never had any truly progressive instincts.
I don’t know why anyone sat on the same side of the church as Donald Trump, let alone next to him. And even worse, interacted with him. Though I know he’s not made of the right stuff, nonetheless, my fervent hope is that Obama said something like, “someday when you least expect it, I’m going to kick your ass”.
I have been leaving comments about this undefended feeling, and need for a LEADER. The Dems do not realize a MAJOR reason for Trump's popularity is he Leads and says he Leads. He is a master at the spotlight. Yelling about the Problem and saying he will FIGHT is all that was needed. Trump voters saw a person who will fight anything or anybody to say what ever problem you face.
Bullseye! Over the past week I have actually said aloud in my most intimate circles,”I hope there is actually a Deep State! I hope it’s using these remaining weeks to strategize to protect the citizenry!”
I mean, you know a hurricane is coming, so you prepare!
So again, you have named something that had no name before. I’m an anti-gun Progressive thinking about whether I should arm myself. Should I bury some cash? Order extra prescription medication?
Your thoughts don’t trend to those dire places unless you feel like your flank is exposed and no army is coming to help. And I’m not gay. I’m not Brown. My heart goes out to those in the figurative crosshairs. FFS.
I want to believe the Democratic Party is leaning upon the best minds in the nation to formulate an actual plan. But given how much it has failed I’m pretty sure that’s wishful thinking.
Know your community. Stay connected to your community. Defend your community.
Proxy fights are very energy depleting and trump hasn’t even been sworn in yet. It won’t come soon enough but enough of us (with the 19 million who wouldn’t vote in the last election) must find our way through, how best to mobilize effectively while speaking truth to power, as Anand demonstrated by a) getting himself in the room and b) speaking directly and briefly to Modi as he did. Small example, but affective.
Let’s stay connected to our bones - our backbone, our flexible bones and (never forget)our funny bone.
The Democratic Party’s former leaders are all co-opted just like former Republican leaderless. We have no one to rally progressive Democrats in the fight to save democracy, to restore the rule of law and fight the billionaire oligarchy. If we the people are to resist the well coordinated efforts of U.S. billionaires to resurrect the robber Barron era of the 1900’s, we need national leaders. We also need to embrace civil disobedience and not behave timidly. Civility is not a requisite for sustaining this constitutional democracy. It may be a hindrance. Ending the Vietnam War, Civil rights and Union rights were not achieved in this nation through civility but through bold often disobedient acts. While Martin Luther King advocated peaceful protests, the Black Panthers were a welcome counter approach that brought fear into the consciousness. I am looking for leaders, probably not politicians, who will organize and mobilize an active and feared resistance movement.
You speak clearly and to the point. We (right across the 'West') face our own timidity as the key stumbling block to our own liberation.
Also, by the way, I think the idea that people shouldn't talk to Trump is silly. Trump is massively disregulated. More social contact can help with that. It's absolutely a public service to help with that if you have access. This idea that we should just be awful to people we disagree with is just making the world a worse place. Imagine if Trump were perfectly happy. Like, really, truly happy, not just happy with his latest endorphin hit. Would he be talking about invading Greenland?
Sadly, I have known people in the past who are, at best, 'consistently inconsistent' - or in old money, two-faced. The challenge is to find a clear path through ...
I think it's silly to talk about this for at least a year. The current Democratic national leadership are .. I don't even know what to say about them. I think they are more the problem than Trump is, and that's really damning them with faint praise. Until they get out of the way, all we can do is work locally. And since they keep spending tons of money to screw up local races, even that is an uphill battle.
I don't really want to hear what they have to say. The time for that is past. If Kamala Harris had issued a mea culpa, if Blinken had admitted he was wrong about Gaza, etc, then maybe I'd be willing to hear something from them. As it is, I still care about them as human beings. E.g., I hope Kamala Harris is okay, and her husband is okay. But as politicians, what I want most from them is that they GTFO.
I'm all about Tim Walz, though. I just wish he hadn't let them muzzle him during the campaign.
BTW, to be super clear about this, I don't watch TV news or read the NYT, so even if they were talking, I might now have heard what they said. I read De Volkskrant. They are kind of a footnote from that perspective.
The question is what is wrong with Trump that he feels no embarrassment or shame about how he talked about ALL of these people. He is the one who should be sheepish and embarrassed. His lack of moral or shame is his superpower.
The Democratic leaders who told us that democracy was dead and Trump was Hitler are now saying.. Nah... Didn't really mean that. And, by the way, we will be holding our "resistances" from Martha's Vineyard and Caribbean islands.
This is an important discussion that I completely relate to. I was very conflicted about Obama's chumminess with Trump. On the one hand, I can see him trying to foster a rapport for potential future negotiations to reign in his worst impulses if necessary. On the other hand, W-T-F? I seriously doubt Michelle would have been that gracious (and notice she didn't bother to go.) I don't agree that they were "all" doing that. From what I saw, the Clintons, Bushes, Kamala and Doug, and the Bidens all ignored Trump and Melania. Trump tried to get Kamala's attention and she deliberately did not look at him. Is that enough? No, but this was a state funeral after all. Should they "boycott?" Maybe the family should not have invited him. He wasn't at Barbara Bush's funeral, and if you saw the official photo the Carter Center released, they literally cropped him out of the photo of the assembled dignitaries. Pence shook his hand which is sickening, given that his life was in danger but I don't really expect anything of him. The only person who was "satisfying" was Karen Pence of all people, rebuffing their outreach with contemptuous silence. One black woman in a private group I am in said "Black people have to do this all the time!" so I can respect I have no experience of being in that position in this racist society but I'm also not a former POTUS looked to for leadership. I also appreciate Anand articulating what is underneath the debate. WHERE ARE THE VOCAL, PASSIONATE LEADERS FOR THIS MOMENT? Who is guiding us as we careen toward autocracy? The threats and actions are happening in plain sight and those who warned us don't seem to be doing anything consequential. We're supposed to rely on Chuck Schumer?! Andrew Weissman said it would be "unseemly" for Garland to release the report without permission. We're still talking about politeness in the face of this madness, as climate change rages, burning homes to the ground in CA (including my BF's house?)? I'm glad Anand is here speaking into this because it is vital at this juncture and if someone with the right skills and calling stepped forward, I believe a movement will rapidly coalesce. That's part of the reason why people rallied instantly behind Kamala. Just give us SOMEONE with a backbone to push back against this insanity! /end rant/
Jimmy Carter, bless his soul, always spoke kindly and shared pleasantries with friends and foes alike. That is how he made the most amazing international peace arrangement that was considered impossible, but it still stands, years later.
I am a Canadian living in Canada, I am very deeply angered and insulted by Rrump’s increasing rhetoric about taking over Canada, Greenland, and the Osnsma Canal. If he stops the two wars that are using American munitions, where will he send the USA weaponry, to the Canadian border perhaps? We in Canada hope most people in the USA will support the integrity and sovereignty of Canada, and continue to be allies and friends. The war and power mongers need to be prevented from destroying a centuries long peaceful friendship.
Sorry for misspelling Trump as well as the Panama Canal.
This reminded me of an interview Biden gave a little while before dropping out of the race- when asked about the prospect of trump winning and what that would mean, he essentially answered "well at least I'll have tried my best."
I couldn't stop thinking about that when he pardoned Hunter. I understand the paternal pull to protect his son, but I couldn't stop thinking about that interview. He's done his best, and now he was confident that his family was going to be fine, relatively speaking. He could shield his son, but what have he and his team been doing to protect people not named Biden from the worst impulses of "America's Hitler" (not my phrase, I forget who said it first though 🤔)? They're preparing for a smooth and efficient transition.
And then Obama sits there, chatting it up with trump and I can't get that interview out of my head. Like I'm watching the end of a little league game, and all the presidents are hi fiving, telling each other good game while the referees bulldoze the ballfield and california burns.
It's not a proxy fight, it's class warfare and none of them are on our side.
I think Obama responding to Trump's overtures with bonhomie has to do with his personality traits. He doesn't have anything to defend, and can just be, in his embodied experience. I imagine he'd josh around with anyone who tugged at him like Trump did at that moment, because Obama at ease is gracious, open and up with people.
Would he josh around with Putin that way? Given what they've all said about him - and what he himself says about his agenda - how different is he than that? He is proposing military attacks on allies for god's sake!
I saw you on "Joe" .... do value your honest and objective opinions. I am a Democrat. I am happy that they are adopting a wait and see approach to the Trump Term. He blusters, he accuses, he threatens - will he do it, can he do it - let them take him on when the time is right. They can meet the moment. Trump is making a fool of himself now with his ridiculous battles. I, too, am waiting and seeing. Those leaders I care about are visible and present.
The only problem with that theory is that they will still have agency to "take him on" if they wait. He has both Houses of Congress. SCOTUS backs him for the most part. He will have DOJ/FBI. Will the military resist his directions if he commands them to attack allies or citizens? Waiting to see has degraded institutions beyond recognition already.
MSNBC is just like the other media outlets, money interests first honesty and truth Even when I liked the content I had a basic distrust of them. Most were Republicans to begin with and have never had any truly progressive instincts.
I don’t know why anyone sat on the same side of the church as Donald Trump, let alone next to him. And even worse, interacted with him. Though I know he’s not made of the right stuff, nonetheless, my fervent hope is that Obama said something like, “someday when you least expect it, I’m going to kick your ass”.
I have been leaving comments about this undefended feeling, and need for a LEADER. The Dems do not realize a MAJOR reason for Trump's popularity is he Leads and says he Leads. He is a master at the spotlight. Yelling about the Problem and saying he will FIGHT is all that was needed. Trump voters saw a person who will fight anything or anybody to say what ever problem you face.
Bullseye! Over the past week I have actually said aloud in my most intimate circles,”I hope there is actually a Deep State! I hope it’s using these remaining weeks to strategize to protect the citizenry!”
I mean, you know a hurricane is coming, so you prepare!
So again, you have named something that had no name before. I’m an anti-gun Progressive thinking about whether I should arm myself. Should I bury some cash? Order extra prescription medication?
Your thoughts don’t trend to those dire places unless you feel like your flank is exposed and no army is coming to help. And I’m not gay. I’m not Brown. My heart goes out to those in the figurative crosshairs. FFS.
I want to believe the Democratic Party is leaning upon the best minds in the nation to formulate an actual plan. But given how much it has failed I’m pretty sure that’s wishful thinking.
Know your community. Stay connected to your community. Defend your community.
Lloyd Gardner
Obama was always that way. Even when he dispatched Biden in favor of Clinton
Proxy fights are very energy depleting and trump hasn’t even been sworn in yet. It won’t come soon enough but enough of us (with the 19 million who wouldn’t vote in the last election) must find our way through, how best to mobilize effectively while speaking truth to power, as Anand demonstrated by a) getting himself in the room and b) speaking directly and briefly to Modi as he did. Small example, but affective.
Let’s stay connected to our bones - our backbone, our flexible bones and (never forget)our funny bone.