I shared a part of this with a friend who is burdened by having to relate and communicate with the many MAGA cultists in her family. She once worked within a Democratic White House, so they cut her some slack, but it can be excruciating for her at the holidays. As I was a practicing therapist for decades, I have felt frustrated trying to articulate the valuable insights modern psychology has given us. Hopefully, if enough non-psychologists read more of these articles, it will be a bright spot on the horizon. Meanwhile, I'll take the permission to go out to the corner brewery once in awhile to schmooze and Represent. Ha ha?
Thank you so much for this interview! I have been looking everywhere for this information like this. This truly is a moment we need help on the psychology! I love Stein’s advice, especially the fight fight fight!
I have my own list of advice I have been working on. I am not a psychologist, but I do have some hard-earned experience. This is just based on personal experience, so please take it as that.
1. Don’t worry about grains of truth that the abuser says. They are grains of truth, but they don’t matter right now. Stop repeating them to yourself and others. This helps the abuser keep their toe hold because you waste energy thinking about the grains of truth and not the elephant in the room. (Conceding that government may have an efficiency problem is not needed right now)
2. Walk right through the fear that you will be abandoned/kicked out of the group. That is how they control you. It will feel like you are walking off the edge of a cliff, but if you do this, the abuser loses power because they can’t manipulate you with fear. (Example Trump has weaponised the voter “mandate” against Democrats, and they just need to stop fearing the voter and do what’s right)
3. The abuser will never go 50 feet over the line where everyone throws up their hands and says this is bad. It will be 1 foot or a few feet at a time over the line. It will be confusing as hell because not everyone will agree what it is, so never wait for that red line in the sand moment of clarity to spur you to action and standing up for what’s right.
4. When people are getting hurt and attacked, don’t pick your battles. Stand up. State your objections clearly and to the point. For example, This is not right. I don’t agree. It’s easier to think I’d better not saying thing because this is just going to stir up even worse vitriol on the abusers part, but then boundaries slide. Boundaries need to be stated, especially if others that may be influenced to the abusers side are watching.
5. Take the abuser at their word, including threatening or off the wall jokes. Jokes are to be taken seriously.
6. Do not spend time blaming yourself. You do not need to spend time re-hashing everything you could have differently for this to be a different outcome. This gives you false sense of control. “If I just changed myself, this would all be different” is a fallacy. Yes, you need to make changes - but they are not the ones you think.
7. Don’t buy into their projections. They will project themselves on to you and it can really trip you up, because you start to see yourself the way they describe you. You lose your identity. (Democratic Party has lost their identity - I think they are even repeating some of stuff MAGA says in self blame). The most important thing to hang on to is your identity.
8. Become educated in trauma responses and abuse patterns (e.g DARVO - Deny Attack Reverse Victim and Offender - example: Trumps response to Jan. 6th) so you can recognise them. It will help you stay sane, because you will know what’s going on.
9. The important thing is finding a therapist or somebody that provides in a reality check. Whatever we do, we need to make sure there are reality checks here. We need to support these reality checks as best we can.
10. Trust your eyes. It is easy to question, is it really as bad as it seems? Are we really in a crises? If you have to ask these questions, you already know the answer.
Most important - we need to speak up , stand up now before it’s too late!!! Now is not the time to be quiet!
Thank you for this insight. It helps me to understand the family members who drifted to the MAGA side. The cruelty of this regime hardens my heart. This softens it.
Thanks for this conversation. Your readers might want to follow Steven Hassan, who is one of the foremost cult and mind control experts and author of The Cult of Trump. He has information on his BITE model (behavior information thought emotion) of cult mind control as well as the Influence Continuum on his website
Honestly I was thinking or writing a similar essay but blatantly calling it “Surviving Trumps Narcissistic Abuse”. Trump is the classic Narcissist and when you are not feeding his narcissistic supply (Dems and anyone who disagrees with him or doesn’t bow down - Pres Zelensky), the Narcissist will heave extremely cruel Narcissistic Rage. They enjoy cruelty. My ex was a classic Narcissist and he was handsome and charming and charismatic, someone I could not comprehend as evil until I stopped feeding his supply and needed help and kids stopped adoring and starting talking back. I left and all hell broke loose. When the Narcissist can no longer control you, he will change the way others see you (Ukraine, 2020 Election lies). I knew what was to come in 2016 and heard my exes second wife tell me he advanced to brutal rape and told her he enjoyed hurting people. Trump 2.0 will be bloody, because he is evolving as a monster within.
When another person asks me to listen, I try to listen with respect and empathy. I have a friend who has preferred Trump to "the alternative." I only respond, so far. I'm hoping that others will help her see the light. In my non-interpersonal life, I keep writing to change hearts and minds. I keep praying for the Spirit of wisdom to inspire sense in people who act irrationally, as I see them.
I shared a part of this with a friend who is burdened by having to relate and communicate with the many MAGA cultists in her family. She once worked within a Democratic White House, so they cut her some slack, but it can be excruciating for her at the holidays. As I was a practicing therapist for decades, I have felt frustrated trying to articulate the valuable insights modern psychology has given us. Hopefully, if enough non-psychologists read more of these articles, it will be a bright spot on the horizon. Meanwhile, I'll take the permission to go out to the corner brewery once in awhile to schmooze and Represent. Ha ha?
Thanks so much for giving something I can share which I did
Thank you so much for this interview! I have been looking everywhere for this information like this. This truly is a moment we need help on the psychology! I love Stein’s advice, especially the fight fight fight!
I have my own list of advice I have been working on. I am not a psychologist, but I do have some hard-earned experience. This is just based on personal experience, so please take it as that.
1. Don’t worry about grains of truth that the abuser says. They are grains of truth, but they don’t matter right now. Stop repeating them to yourself and others. This helps the abuser keep their toe hold because you waste energy thinking about the grains of truth and not the elephant in the room. (Conceding that government may have an efficiency problem is not needed right now)
2. Walk right through the fear that you will be abandoned/kicked out of the group. That is how they control you. It will feel like you are walking off the edge of a cliff, but if you do this, the abuser loses power because they can’t manipulate you with fear. (Example Trump has weaponised the voter “mandate” against Democrats, and they just need to stop fearing the voter and do what’s right)
3. The abuser will never go 50 feet over the line where everyone throws up their hands and says this is bad. It will be 1 foot or a few feet at a time over the line. It will be confusing as hell because not everyone will agree what it is, so never wait for that red line in the sand moment of clarity to spur you to action and standing up for what’s right.
4. When people are getting hurt and attacked, don’t pick your battles. Stand up. State your objections clearly and to the point. For example, This is not right. I don’t agree. It’s easier to think I’d better not saying thing because this is just going to stir up even worse vitriol on the abusers part, but then boundaries slide. Boundaries need to be stated, especially if others that may be influenced to the abusers side are watching.
5. Take the abuser at their word, including threatening or off the wall jokes. Jokes are to be taken seriously.
6. Do not spend time blaming yourself. You do not need to spend time re-hashing everything you could have differently for this to be a different outcome. This gives you false sense of control. “If I just changed myself, this would all be different” is a fallacy. Yes, you need to make changes - but they are not the ones you think.
7. Don’t buy into their projections. They will project themselves on to you and it can really trip you up, because you start to see yourself the way they describe you. You lose your identity. (Democratic Party has lost their identity - I think they are even repeating some of stuff MAGA says in self blame). The most important thing to hang on to is your identity.
8. Become educated in trauma responses and abuse patterns (e.g DARVO - Deny Attack Reverse Victim and Offender - example: Trumps response to Jan. 6th) so you can recognise them. It will help you stay sane, because you will know what’s going on.
9. The important thing is finding a therapist or somebody that provides in a reality check. Whatever we do, we need to make sure there are reality checks here. We need to support these reality checks as best we can.
10. Trust your eyes. It is easy to question, is it really as bad as it seems? Are we really in a crises? If you have to ask these questions, you already know the answer.
Most important - we need to speak up , stand up now before it’s too late!!! Now is not the time to be quiet!
Thank you for this insight. It helps me to understand the family members who drifted to the MAGA side. The cruelty of this regime hardens my heart. This softens it.
Thank you Anand.
Thanks for this conversation. Your readers might want to follow Steven Hassan, who is one of the foremost cult and mind control experts and author of The Cult of Trump. He has information on his BITE model (behavior information thought emotion) of cult mind control as well as the Influence Continuum on his website
https://freedomofmind.com/cult-mind-control/influence-continuum/.
Steve Hassan also has a substack https://stevenhassan.substack.com/
As a psychiatrist I am interested in promoting empowerment over subjugation and egalitarianism over social dominance. You can read more here
Which of Six Power Types Will You Embody and Support? | Psychology Today https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-pacific-heart/202209/which-of-six-power-types-will-you-embody-and-support
and
MOSF 19.5: Dangerous Charisma: Unpacking Trump’s Leadership and His Followers’ Mentality https://eastwindezine.com/mosf-19-5-dangerous-charisma-unpacking-trumps-leadership-and-his-followers-mentality/ as well as follow me on Substack https://sunmoonlight.substack.com/
Honestly I was thinking or writing a similar essay but blatantly calling it “Surviving Trumps Narcissistic Abuse”. Trump is the classic Narcissist and when you are not feeding his narcissistic supply (Dems and anyone who disagrees with him or doesn’t bow down - Pres Zelensky), the Narcissist will heave extremely cruel Narcissistic Rage. They enjoy cruelty. My ex was a classic Narcissist and he was handsome and charming and charismatic, someone I could not comprehend as evil until I stopped feeding his supply and needed help and kids stopped adoring and starting talking back. I left and all hell broke loose. When the Narcissist can no longer control you, he will change the way others see you (Ukraine, 2020 Election lies). I knew what was to come in 2016 and heard my exes second wife tell me he advanced to brutal rape and told her he enjoyed hurting people. Trump 2.0 will be bloody, because he is evolving as a monster within.
When another person asks me to listen, I try to listen with respect and empathy. I have a friend who has preferred Trump to "the alternative." I only respond, so far. I'm hoping that others will help her see the light. In my non-interpersonal life, I keep writing to change hearts and minds. I keep praying for the Spirit of wisdom to inspire sense in people who act irrationally, as I see them.
This means so much to me. It explains the situation beautifully and helped me make some sense of the current state of affairs. I now have a plan!
Trump has had no control over his bowels for almost 40 years,so maybe that’s why he wants absolute control over everything and everyone else.
Tech billionaires & MAGA...free speech is for right wing propagandists only? Speak up, spread the word. #Resist their censorship & propaganda.
https://www.commoncause.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/FireMuskPoster_8.5x11.pdf